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	<title>Comments on: Iran repression: the other side of the technology story</title>
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	<link>http://www.kgadams.net/2009/06/27/iran-repression-the-other-side-of-the-technology-story</link>
	<description>Technology, computer games, MMOGs,  science...and other nerdy stuff</description>
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		<title>By: Chris</title>
		<link>http://www.kgadams.net/2009/06/27/iran-repression-the-other-side-of-the-technology-story/comment-page-1#comment-25185</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Jun 2009 21:40:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.kgadams.net/2009/06/27/iran-repression-the-other-side-of-the-technology-story#comment-25185</guid>
		<description>One thing is that while people can &quot;force&quot; you to do something, they can&#039;t make you like it.   Oh they will want to ... I can&#039;t begin to tell you how much stuff we get at work about &quot;proper attitude&quot; and how incensed the Powers That Be get when you don&#039;t thank them for screwing you over.  And how &quot;hurt&quot; they are that morale is low (duh ... low morale is a reflection on your job, not ours!)

But while they can command obedience in return for a paycheck they cannot buy true respect.  

And sometimes, the scorn and contempt of those around you, even if you are civil in the workplace can have an effect.

We may not be brave/involved enough to withhold consent - but we certainly can withhold our blessing.  And as long as there is any humanity left in the system that will make some difference.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>One thing is that while people can &#8220;force&#8221; you to do something, they can&#8217;t make you like it.   Oh they will want to &#8230; I can&#8217;t begin to tell you how much stuff we get at work about &#8220;proper attitude&#8221; and how incensed the Powers That Be get when you don&#8217;t thank them for screwing you over.  And how &#8220;hurt&#8221; they are that morale is low (duh &#8230; low morale is a reflection on your job, not ours!)</p>
<p>But while they can command obedience in return for a paycheck they cannot buy true respect.  </p>
<p>And sometimes, the scorn and contempt of those around you, even if you are civil in the workplace can have an effect.</p>
<p>We may not be brave/involved enough to withhold consent &#8211; but we certainly can withhold our blessing.  And as long as there is any humanity left in the system that will make some difference.</p>
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		<title>By: Kelly Adams</title>
		<link>http://www.kgadams.net/2009/06/27/iran-repression-the-other-side-of-the-technology-story/comment-page-1#comment-25180</link>
		<dc:creator>Kelly Adams</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Jun 2009 18:44:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.kgadams.net/2009/06/27/iran-repression-the-other-side-of-the-technology-story#comment-25180</guid>
		<description>You are, of course, right Chris.  I wouldn&#039;t really know how I would react in that situation.  I&#039;d like to think I would do something more than  just fly off to Iran to work on their &quot;communications intelligence&quot; system, but I probably would just do my job and take my cheque.  And hate myself just a little bit more.

However, that doesn&#039;t change the fact that corporations should take some kind of look at the regimes they sell to, and how their products are used.  Naturally, it won&#039;t be a particularly hard look: but if it is a small drop in the revenue ocean, the opportunity exists to earn some global good will by saying &quot;No, we don&#039;t serve governments that oppress their populations.&quot;

And of course, if it is a significant part of their revenue, the realities of the stock market will demand that companies serve even the most violently genocidal dictators unless their home government explicitly forbids such trade.  But if enough individual employees raise issues with assignments to that country, the company might just have to listen.  Most big companies do listen at least a little bit to what their employees say, and sometimes a difference can be made.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You are, of course, right Chris.  I wouldn&#8217;t really know how I would react in that situation.  I&#8217;d like to think I would do something more than  just fly off to Iran to work on their &#8220;communications intelligence&#8221; system, but I probably would just do my job and take my cheque.  And hate myself just a little bit more.</p>
<p>However, that doesn&#8217;t change the fact that corporations should take some kind of look at the regimes they sell to, and how their products are used.  Naturally, it won&#8217;t be a particularly hard look: but if it is a small drop in the revenue ocean, the opportunity exists to earn some global good will by saying &#8220;No, we don&#8217;t serve governments that oppress their populations.&#8221;</p>
<p>And of course, if it is a significant part of their revenue, the realities of the stock market will demand that companies serve even the most violently genocidal dictators unless their home government explicitly forbids such trade.  But if enough individual employees raise issues with assignments to that country, the company might just have to listen.  Most big companies do listen at least a little bit to what their employees say, and sometimes a difference can be made.</p>
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		<title>By: Chris</title>
		<link>http://www.kgadams.net/2009/06/27/iran-repression-the-other-side-of-the-technology-story/comment-page-1#comment-25179</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Jun 2009 17:29:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.kgadams.net/2009/06/27/iran-repression-the-other-side-of-the-technology-story#comment-25179</guid>
		<description>We all like to think we&#039;d resign, but would we really? You are some guy with a big mortgage, a kid or two, if american maybe with a minor ailment that would still bankrupt you without a company healthcare plan, and in the worst job market for decades.

And I&#039;m sure when the technology was being developed, and the locals trained in it&#039;s use the usual rationalizations were applied: &quot;better that they have monitored communications than no cell phones at all - the good will outweigh the bad.&quot;,&quot;if we don&#039;t sell it to them someone else will.&quot;,&quot;yes, it might be misused,but this technology will let us stop another 911 or worse, and catch the really bad people.&quot;  And now it&#039;s implemented and being used what do you do? Stop maintaining the network? Who would that hurt more? The protesters or the government?

Not the clearest of questions, especially if you are staring unemployment in the face.

And look at your own comments on my blog:
&quot;Strangely, I don’t care a great deal about what is happening in Iran. I think it is because even the “moderates” believe in a rigidly defined system that locks women in the home and considers adultry worthy of capital punishment. If it was a majority very progressive culture being oppressed by a minority, I might feel differently, but that really doesn’t seem to be the case.

I hope that the people there get the representation they want, but frankly… I sort of feel about the same about Iran’s current problems as I do about the perpetually developing Idiocracy south of the border. The majority of Iran’s population really does seem to want religious rule according to a strict and, to my thinking, extremely backwards set of rules. If that’s what they want, well, I’m sad to see that, but it’s their *majority* choice.&quot;

The sad truth is that we, as a society, seldom reward people for doing the right thing. Not really. Part of that is the capitalist system which is amoral - good or bad doesn&#039;t matter as long as you make money, and part of that  is that we humans still have tribal brains - unless it affects us or those we know directly it&#039;s hard to get worked up about it.

It would be nice if the guys working for Nokia / siemens et all resigned rather than do work to support repressive regimes, but there are very understandable reasons why they probably won&#039;t.  And unless we do things to change that, to make doing the right thing supported, encouraged and economically survivable, then sadly we can&#039;t really expect them to.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>We all like to think we&#8217;d resign, but would we really? You are some guy with a big mortgage, a kid or two, if american maybe with a minor ailment that would still bankrupt you without a company healthcare plan, and in the worst job market for decades.</p>
<p>And I&#8217;m sure when the technology was being developed, and the locals trained in it&#8217;s use the usual rationalizations were applied: &#8220;better that they have monitored communications than no cell phones at all &#8211; the good will outweigh the bad.&#8221;,&#8221;if we don&#8217;t sell it to them someone else will.&#8221;,&#8221;yes, it might be misused,but this technology will let us stop another 911 or worse, and catch the really bad people.&#8221;  And now it&#8217;s implemented and being used what do you do? Stop maintaining the network? Who would that hurt more? The protesters or the government?</p>
<p>Not the clearest of questions, especially if you are staring unemployment in the face.</p>
<p>And look at your own comments on my blog:<br />
&#8220;Strangely, I don’t care a great deal about what is happening in Iran. I think it is because even the “moderates” believe in a rigidly defined system that locks women in the home and considers adultry worthy of capital punishment. If it was a majority very progressive culture being oppressed by a minority, I might feel differently, but that really doesn’t seem to be the case.</p>
<p>I hope that the people there get the representation they want, but frankly… I sort of feel about the same about Iran’s current problems as I do about the perpetually developing Idiocracy south of the border. The majority of Iran’s population really does seem to want religious rule according to a strict and, to my thinking, extremely backwards set of rules. If that’s what they want, well, I’m sad to see that, but it’s their *majority* choice.&#8221;</p>
<p>The sad truth is that we, as a society, seldom reward people for doing the right thing. Not really. Part of that is the capitalist system which is amoral &#8211; good or bad doesn&#8217;t matter as long as you make money, and part of that  is that we humans still have tribal brains &#8211; unless it affects us or those we know directly it&#8217;s hard to get worked up about it.</p>
<p>It would be nice if the guys working for Nokia / siemens et all resigned rather than do work to support repressive regimes, but there are very understandable reasons why they probably won&#8217;t.  And unless we do things to change that, to make doing the right thing supported, encouraged and economically survivable, then sadly we can&#8217;t really expect them to.</p>
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